Official Luthiers Forum!

Owned and operated by Lance Kragenbrink
It is currently Sat Nov 30, 2024 9:18 pm


All times are UTC - 5 hours





Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 12 posts ] 
Author Message
PostPosted: Mon Nov 23, 2015 10:01 am 
Offline
Walnut
Walnut

Joined: Sat Nov 21, 2015 6:28 pm
Posts: 2
First name: John
Last Name: Lanzerotte
City: Carlinville
State: Il
Zip/Postal Code: 62626
Country: USA
Focus: Build
Status: Semi-pro
I made two small holes in the top to glue small cleats across the crack using a (.001) string to clamp the patch. process works fine but cannot hide the holes. Everything applied to date (lacquer, super glue, Tite bond mixed with matching wood fibers) wicks the finish and leaves a dark spot. I've even had an artist friend try to match the color of the spruce but couldn't get the color thin enough to still mask the spots. Suggestions?


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Nov 23, 2015 10:54 am 
Offline
Brazilian Rosewood
Brazilian Rosewood

Joined: Wed Apr 08, 2009 9:34 am
Posts: 3081
I know of nothing that will fix a flaw on spruce.


Last edited by Haans on Mon Nov 23, 2015 12:57 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Nov 23, 2015 12:38 pm 
Offline
Old Growth Brazilian Rosewood
Old Growth Brazilian Rosewood
User avatar

Joined: Fri Nov 02, 2007 9:49 am
Posts: 13391
Location: Ann Arbor, Michigan
First name: Hesh
Last Name: Breakstone
City: Ann Arbor
State: Michigan
Country: United States
Status: Professional
Haans wrote:
I know of nothing that will fix a flew on spruce.


Yep same here and although too late drilling holes in a top to cleat a crack is never necessary..... Don't you hate people who have a penchant for saying the wrong thing....:)

Perhaps stickers? :o :D


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Nov 23, 2015 2:06 pm 
Offline
Contributing Member
Contributing Member
User avatar

Joined: Wed Oct 08, 2008 11:36 am
Posts: 7380
Location: Southeast US
City: Lenoir City
State: TN
Zip/Postal Code: 37772
Country: US
Focus: Repair
I have patched spruce on the edge (near invisible but still can be found) but don't think there is any clean way to do it in the middle of the top.

_________________
Steve Smith
"Music is what feelings sound like"


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Nov 23, 2015 4:26 pm 
Offline
Old Growth Brazilian Rosewood
Old Growth Brazilian Rosewood
User avatar

Joined: Fri Nov 02, 2007 9:49 am
Posts: 13391
Location: Ann Arbor, Michigan
First name: Hesh
Last Name: Breakstone
City: Ann Arbor
State: Michigan
Country: United States
Status: Professional
You can turn some plugs out of the same spruce on a lathe and then chase your tail matching the grain direction but they will show too.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Nov 23, 2015 7:27 pm 
Offline
Contributing Member
Contributing Member
User avatar

Joined: Wed Oct 08, 2008 11:36 am
Posts: 7380
Location: Southeast US
City: Lenoir City
State: TN
Zip/Postal Code: 37772
Country: US
Focus: Repair
I use a gouge to cut a groove and a matching filler piece. Clamp tight with HHG - it's ok on the edge for small chips but it still shows. Probably better off to live with the filled hole if it is as small as you said.

Did you punch it or drill it? If punched or caused by the string when you clamped the crack closed then you might hit it with a bit of steam to see if the hole will close up some, the same way you would steam a dent. I use a small piece of double-folded damp T shirt over the dent and touch a soldering iron to it, steams immediately in a small controlled area.

EDIT: went back and read the original post. Looks like you've moved past any possibility of using steam.

_________________
Steve Smith
"Music is what feelings sound like"



These users thanked the author SteveSmith for the post: Ohnja (Tue Nov 24, 2015 8:05 am)
Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Nov 23, 2015 11:33 pm 
Offline
Cocobolo
Cocobolo
User avatar

Joined: Fri Feb 18, 2005 6:18 am
Posts: 265
Location: United States
First name: Frank
Last Name: Ford
City: Palo Alto
State: CA
Zip/Postal Code: 94301
Country: USA
Focus: Repair
Status: Professional
There is a sort of classic technique to fill holes, but the lighter the wood and the lighter the finish the more difficult it is. SO, spruce tops on guitars present the most nasty problem. Here's a piece I wrote up on the process, and, if you follow it through, you'll see that, in my hands at least, it isn't exactly quick easy to do:

http://www.frets.com/FretsPages/Luthier/Technique/Structural/SpruceHole/sprucehole.html

_________________
Cheers,

Frank Ford

FRETS.COM
HomeShopTech
FRETS.NET



These users thanked the author Frank Ford for the post: Ohnja (Tue Nov 24, 2015 8:06 am)
Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue Nov 24, 2015 6:42 am 
Offline
Contributing Member
Contributing Member
User avatar

Joined: Wed Oct 08, 2008 11:36 am
Posts: 7380
Location: Southeast US
City: Lenoir City
State: TN
Zip/Postal Code: 37772
Country: US
Focus: Repair
I had forgotten but that's obviously where I picked up the gouge technique and a far better explanation too. Thanks Frank.

_________________
Steve Smith
"Music is what feelings sound like"


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue Nov 24, 2015 8:09 am 
Offline
Brazilian Rosewood
Brazilian Rosewood
User avatar

Joined: Mon Dec 27, 2010 9:06 pm
Posts: 2739
Location: Magnolia DE
First name: Brian
Last Name: Howard
City: Magnolia
State: Delaware
Zip/Postal Code: 19962
Country: United States
Focus: Repair
Status: Professional
Burn in sticks are made for things like this.

_________________
Brian

You never know what you are capable of until you actually try.

https://www.howardguitarsdelaware.com/


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue Nov 24, 2015 8:38 am 
Offline
Brazilian Rosewood
Brazilian Rosewood

Joined: Wed Apr 08, 2009 9:34 am
Posts: 3081
I forgot, black spray paint.



These users thanked the author Haans for the post: Hesh (Sun Jan 03, 2016 2:44 pm)
Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Jan 03, 2016 1:55 pm 
Offline
Walnut
Walnut

Joined: Sat Nov 21, 2015 6:28 pm
Posts: 2
First name: John
Last Name: Lanzerotte
City: Carlinville
State: Il
Zip/Postal Code: 62626
Country: USA
Focus: Build
Status: Semi-pro
After many trials I was ultimately able to repair the "spots" and finish the top satisfactorily. I used the technique similar to that described by Frank Ford. I excavated the spots and accumulated glue,filler, etc. with a small "v" shaped gouge. I reversed the direction at the center of spot to avoid a grain tear out. I mirrored the same process (but going a little deeper) to harvest the patches under the bridge and fingerboard tongue. I used superglue and as much hand pressure as I could muster until the glue set. 8 or so hours later (wanted to allow for rebound of the patch) I scraped the patches flush and sanded the top and finished with lacquer. After final buff the spots were still somewhat visible but overall much much better than fillers, burn in sticks, color, etc.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Jan 03, 2016 11:10 pm 
Offline
Brazilian Rosewood
Brazilian Rosewood

Joined: Tue May 13, 2008 10:44 am
Posts: 6256
Location: Virginia
Ohnja, I'd love to see before, during, and after photo's if you got them. That's a real tough thing to hide. I'm a big fan of tuner type clamps where you use a string and tuner to pull together a seam especially in backs and sides where you have to align the warped sides of the crack before clamping. Magnets work well unless you have to pull together damaged parts then the tuner clamps really shine. But for the top you usually don't need to drill a hole. you can push a thin string right through the spruce and it leaves nary a trace.


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 12 posts ] 

All times are UTC - 5 hours


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 15 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group
phpBB customization services by 2by2host.com